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All Motor 3.8

76K views 188 replies 25 participants last post by  Cosmicpossum 
#1 ·
Hello all,
This my 2013 Genesis Coupe 3.8 Track 8AT I've had it now for nearly 3 years.











(Currently)
Engine:
- Turbokit w/ 6266 JB Precision Turbo
- Turboxs RSD catback
- 6 port devils own meth kit
- TK headers
- Dual turbosmart wastegates
- Dustin Davis's Engine leash
- Koyo Radiator
- Derale 18 - row transmission cooler
- Mishimoto oil cooler
- mishimoto baffled oil catch can
- mishimoto rad hoses
- fuse box/ lightweight battery relocation kit by BTR
- Snoopy's Slim fan shrouds
- Ported & Polished TB and IM

(Currently)
Suspension:
- Stance Supersport coils
- Enthuspec Endlinks
- Stock Sway bars (going to Whiteline in the front and Eibach in the rear)
- Soon be corner balanced

(Currently)
Brakes/Wheels/Tires
- Motul R600 Brake fluid
- StopTech Slotted rotors
- Hawk HPS brake pads
- Enthuspec SS Brake lines
- Custom Brake ducts
- Enkeis RS05RR 9.5/10.5 x 18
- Continental DW 255/40 285/40

(Currently)
Exterior :
- Painted Gemeni Hood
- CF fog bezel
- M&S style lip
- APR Splitter
- Dual low beam projectors
-Quik Latch Hood pins

(Currently)
Drivetrain:
- Level 10 Valvebody and Torque Converter
- JRC Diff cover (sitting in garage)
- ATQ diff mount (waiting to be shipped)
- PBM Solid subframe bushing (sitting in garage)

(Currently)
Interior:
- Stock with the exception of some gauges


Ever since I bought I've been tinkering with it. Since this was my first car I've ever modified I've hit alot of road blocks and obstacles but I always kept pushing forward. About a year and a half ago I bought the turbokit from Turbokitts.com, TK headers, redo the up pipe, custom fab a Turboxs RSD catback from the 2.0T, 6 - port Methanol/water injection and more. Between school and work it has become every more difficult to maintain the car to be able to take it the track (time and money being a factor). The turbokit itself was not the issue, it's an amazing piece and I am very pleased with the outcome and the customer service was incredible! Made 420WHP/400WTQ at a measly 7psi on a 90degree day! Thanks Jesse! Just have different plans for the car to be a bit more hassle - free to be able to beat on it and still drive it home without have to worry how I am going to go to work/school. As I love this platform I decided to not sell the car and just sell the turbokit. So this well be a documented journey back to NA from FI.



So my first plan of attack:

A good friend of mine and a mechanic will help me undo the turbokit and weld the oil drain spot in the upper oil pan. Also since I'll be selling the headers along with the kit and exhaust as well; I ordered CP-E longtube headers with Catted X-pipe and CNT catback. Also with the turbokit having removed my wiper fluid container, I will be doing a custom 3.5" intake into the foglight area near where my oil cooler sits. This will also be followed Unorthodox Racing lightweight pulleys.

Reasons for choosing these parts:

CPE headers in my opinion are the only headers made for these cars for NA application that have any sort of science behind them. Other companies use 2" primaries and short distance before the collectors. Even the collectors don't have a good design (most do not have a collector spike that smoothes the air going in to the exhaust). This causes the velocity of exhaust to decrease which on NA application is most critical when searching for max VE. Thats why most say "headers dont add power". You cant just slap on some tubes to the end of the exhaust port think it's going to gain power. End Rant/ lol. CPE uses 1.75" inch primaries which a pretty long and have proper collector followed by an X - pipe. Long Tube headers promote scavenging by keeping exhaust pulses separated and moving at high speed for as long as possible. This helps with low and midrange torque. X - pipe is also important in balancing the velocities of both banks since it is a V - configuration engine. I will be posting dyno sheets after parts are installed and tuned for.

CNT exhaust because it is cheap and sounds good. Theres really not much more too it. It's 2.5 inch which is still too big for these cars (NA) probably.

Custom 3.5" intake in foglight area - Short ram intake literally sit in a hot ass engine bay, sure with the hood open on the dyno you can see some gains but close the hood and a couple pulls and you will see it is worse than stock. I will be wrapping my intake DEI reflective heat wrap and providing fresh air from the opened foglight area. I chose a slightly bigger size than the TB (3.25") because future mods will most likely warrant more air flow.

Unorthodox Racing Pulleys - these provide the most weight savings and are backed by reputable company, and if Travis runs them then so do I lol

Hopefully by the end of the year the Lap3 tuning module will be out and I can tune for this setup and provide some numbers and proof for my claims.

Stage 2:

So now we move into uncharted territory, I will be purchasing Bisimoto Stage 2 camshafts with their springs and retainer kit. Bisi claims an additional 15% of power with supporting mods of course. Now based on these numbers if I can extract 300whp from my initial setup then I could easily be bumped a whopping 45 whp leaving me at powerful 345whp. Now clearing from past attempts and other V6 platforms not gaining these numbers with just cams I will try to do the best I can for max volumetric efficiency at stock displacement. Before getting the cams I will going to a local fabricator and see if he can help me create a new custom intake manifold, preferably dual plane with 2 2.0T throttle bodies. After this I will be doing cams and doing some extensive porting and polishing of the heads (valve bowls, 3 – angle valve job, gasket matching everything, opening up a little the exhaust ports). Now with all this in place my hope is to reach 350-360whp, being conservative I would say 340whp.

Again these numbers are all hypothetical and will be proven probably somewhere in the early spring.

All in all, whatever numbers I get from these mods it will definitely increase the powerband all around to make for a very safe, reliable, and powerful car to track and daily drive, which really what else can you ask for. My goal is not to have the highest HP, or the fastest. There will always be someone faster someone with more money etc.. lol I wanted to build the motor for a mild NA setup because ultimately I like the beauty of it, sounds, and complexities. While it being a mild build, it would be very reliable and with minimal maintenance required. I would be to beat and abuse it at the track and drive it back home all the time. It would also be nice to show some NA potential of these cars. I think Dustin Davis shares my thoughts a little.

I will be updating this post with pictures and more description of this progress in order to shine a light into the dark and forgotten side of Naturally Aspirated power. Any and all questions are welcomed as I am also learning in this process!
 
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#2 ·
Great read, can't wait to see the "you're crazy" responses for ditching the turbo kit. I think the lambda gdi has a lot of potential n/a, we just need to spend time with r&d. Very hard to do with out a tuning solution, so lap3 will be a big reason this succeeds or fails.

Very interested in the long tubes. I already explained my theory to you, so this should be good.

We are most certainly in agreement and i look forward to collaborating with you.
 
#4 ·
Subbed for sure. I'll never go FI but more options on the NA platform are something I constantly look for on these forums.
 
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#6 ·




CPE headers came in already ceramic coated in silver!
Also CNT exhaust came in all good no damage.

I also ordered my lightweight pulleys from unorthodox racing, Gates racing belt, and some new Iridium spark plugs.

Hopefully in the following week or two I can start the conversion back to NA. I will be doing a baffled oil pan with trap doors etc.. Better safe than sorry. I will be posting up the design and pics as soon as it starts.

Before doing the intake manifold I will likely be swapping out my suspension for PBM coils and new sway bars. All will be updated here!
 
#9 ·




Alright then, so new CPE headers are installed as well as CNT exhaust. Ill soon be pulling the oil pan and likely be creating a custom baffle for it. Ill be using trap doors from Improved Racing. Unfortunately Lap3 has not said a word about their module so I am already considering other options, like maybe driving up to BTR when the car is ready. We will see lol.

In regards to the intake manifold, I might scrap the twin plenum idea and just try to get a 90mm TB and do an LS type intake manifold. It'll have long enough (12-15 inch)runners to help long end torque as the runners will wrap around the plenum. Any ideas are welcomed.

I've been trying to take some queues from Sasha's 350z build (400whp NA) hopefully if i can just mimic some of his ways I can reach my goals.
 
#11 ·
You have a link to the 350 build?

Those headers look really nice. How was the fitment and install? I'm assuming since you have the oil pan off you haven't driven it yet. Curious on your impressions.
 
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#13 ·
Nissan 350Z VQ35DE Engine Build - Modified Magazine

OnPoint Dyno's 350Z

There's more but that's a start lol

Fitment of the headers is next to perfect, properly made. I have no doubt in my head these were made with a science not just some crap they welded together. Comes with 4 ports on each headers. 2 O2 sensors and then for whatever else you want, (dual channel wideband, EGT sensor etc..). Install was not bad, jacking up the motor and removing the steering rack made it significantly easier. The headers sit pretty low as any longtube would so I have to be careful for the time being. Ill take some pics when I can.

Oil pan is in i forget to take pictures but it's basically just welded in properly and cleaned up. Made sure the trap doors open full swing. This is the link for the trap doors: Trap Doors for Oil Pans and Fuel Cells (4-Pack) EMR-20X-KIT

As far as oil, I was using 10W-40 ZRod from AMSoil but I decided to switch back to AMSoil Sig Series 5W-30. ZRod has a high zinc content that gets burned and will eventually clog the new cats. Sig series offers enough protection life span for NA.

The CNT exhaust really showed it's worth yesterday lol, it was off from the headers by like an inch. I had to reweld it. I assume it was because of the tolerances of the flex section of the OE downpipes.

I will adding a stage in between 1 and 2. Stage 1.5: I will be swapping out my Stance Super sports, for KW V3s and going with a couple more suspension and drivetrain mods.
 
#24 ·
The event in April I might attend if by then Lap3 doesn't come out the module. I'd have to crunch the build or just get it rerouted down the road. Probably get it hauled to BTR headquarters. I'll tell you right now tho if you're planning on going FI in the future don't bother with NA mods. They are two different worlds with different requirements and priorities. I would focus on cooling, cooling , cooling lol. And yeah I live by Saint Cloud/ Kissimme area. I don't usually go out to meets lol I've been meaning to. Let me know if you have any questions I try to help my best or if you need any help with parts lol. I'm selling my turbokit for cheap right now if you're interested. If you can pick it up I'll drop the current price by 700$. PM if you're interested. :wink:
 
#32 ·


Alright so I drove her yesterday and I was still impressed. I thought there was going to be a crushing disappointment when I touched the throttle lol. But anyways there was plenty of midrange torque available but was lacking at higher speeds compared to the turbo. The car is in desperate need for a tune I could feel the dips in the powerband through RPMs. Throttle response was snappy but could be better, going to tighten the leash a lot today. Pulleys have been shipped should be here next week. Exhaust, TK headers, and 6 port meth kit has sold! KWs are about to be purchased. I am very excited about this lol. Hopefully I'll get the new coils and get it corner balanced and aligned within the same week.

As for exhaust tone of the CPE headers, catted X pipe, and CNT it was really quiet at idle and start up. When I get on the throttle it has a raspy, race car tone (that particular V6 sound). I enjoy it but I am sure it's not everyones favorite lol. No drone in the cabin at any speeds.


Bored 4.2L is starting to sound more attractive the more I think about it. The car is heavy so providing it low and midrange torque would be optimal to mustering it out of a corner or even daily driving fun. Let me know what you guys think. This is the parts list I've compiled:

-Weisco Overbore pistons from Travis :)
-Possibly new light weight rods
-New Hyundai bearing WPC treated
-Sleeves from Travis
-Ferrea Valve train (+1mm intake / exhaust )
- Extensive headporting
- Treat the OEM camshafts
=(not including labor but including machine cost) Cost= 4.2 - 4.7K

Engine has 56XXX miles on it so if there's any recommendations on what to replace while I am in there let me know (timing chain, oil pump etc...)

Maybe in the future I will drop in Bisi cams but for 2017 thats looking like the goal. I will also hold off the intake manifold until I decide if I am going to bore or not since I would like tailor it to that setup if anything.
 
#189 ·


Alright so I drove her yesterday and I was still impressed. I thought there was going to be a crushing disappointment when I touched the throttle lol. But anyways there was plenty of midrange torque available but was lacking at higher speeds compared to the turbo. The car is in desperate need for a tune I could feel the dips in the powerband through RPMs. Throttle response was snappy but could be better, going to tighten the leash a lot today. Pulleys have been shipped should be here next week. Exhaust, TK headers, and 6 port meth kit has sold! KWs are about to be purchased. I am very excited about this lol. Hopefully I'll get the new coils and get it corner balanced and aligned within the same week.

As for exhaust tone of the CPE headers, catted X pipe, and CNT it was really quiet at idle and start up. When I get on the throttle it has a raspy, race car tone (that particular V6 sound). I enjoy it but I am sure it's not everyones favorite lol. No drone in the cabin at any speeds.


Bored 4.2L is starting to sound more attractive the more I think about it. The car is heavy so providing it low and midrange torque would be optimal to mustering it out of a corner or even daily driving fun. Let me know what you guys think. This is the parts list I've compiled:

-Weisco Overbore pistons from Travis :)
-Possibly new light weight rods
-New Hyundai bearing WPC treated
-Sleeves from Travis
-Ferrea Valve train (+1mm intake / exhaust )
  • Extensive headporting
  • Treat the OEM camshafts
=(not including labor but including machine cost) Cost= 4.2 - 4.7K

Engine has 56XXX miles on it so if there's any recommendations on what to replace while I am in there let me know (timing chain, oil pump etc...)

Maybe in the future I will drop in Bisi cams but for 2017 thats looking like the goal. I will also hold off the intake manifold until I decide if I am going to bore or not since I would like tailor it to that setup if anything.
Exhaust clip?
 
#34 ·
Subd for future updates
 
#35 ·
KWs have been ordered!

TK headers + custom Up pipe has been sold
Catback is still in the works of been sold,
Meth kit has been sold

Next up is Whiteline sway bars, corner balancing, and alignment.

I think I have officially decided on the 4.2Lbased on a couple threads I found I'll post some up soon !
 
#36 · (Edited)
Rods,pistons,sleeves,valves/springs ,head work /cams etc and throw some N2O on top ,say 100 shot with progressive controller.Skip the high $$$$$ stroking crank and go with the 3.90:1 gears for the TQ value .4th rear diff bushing mount .Custom tune for 91 oct (to keep ignition timing mapped not too far advanced for nitrous sake).Drag radials on 18x10.5 rears and run low to mid 11 seconds 1/4 while still being able to street cruise and hit corners.Many build these Gen's up and can't get the final result to run along side other brands with the same $$$$ invested .Stroke crank is good for TQ #'s at the expense of elevated piston speed , beating the crap out of the rod bearings in due time and also being unable to run at higher RPM's with a stroker crank , get the OEM crank race prepped .
 
#37 ·
@Tuffbuffalooo IIRC @Ryengoth said going up in size on the exhaust valve was pointless. Wonder at what point it would make sense?
 
#39 ·
Yeah on stock displacement it wouldn't beneficial at all, since rhe intake diameter is so large it actually slows air velocity down, then the exhaust needs plenty of scavenging to remove all that air.

On a 4.2L displacement you are increasing the amount going in, it should make the intake valve diameter a proper size while exhaust valve would be too restrictive, so just widening the exhaust port would be beneficial in theory but who knows lol I talked it over with Snoopy and Travis they said if there's ever a time where you can increase displacement do it. Also Snoopy signed off on the +1mm larger exhaust valves.

The parts for this build I'm not too concerned about it's the labor after lol
 
#40 ·
You want to retain some of that gas pressure on the exhaust stroke if you're N/A, just like @TuffBuffalooo said.
The intake valve is large enough for as much as you can squeeze out of that stroke length. If you do go +1mm on intake, it needs to be on the MPI only. You don't need fuel compensation by air volume at the valve. It's irrelevant due to DI and if you put in Ferrea valves the profile is slim enough to support what the block can do N/A. I would recommend knife edge and opening the leading port on the exhaust side though. It's been untested but it should help with scavenging due to pressure variance between upstream and downstream runners.

Here's what I did on the intake. For N/A I would not smooth the runners but level with sand rolls and leave a texture.


For exhaust:



 
#48 ·
To note there is a Grey BK1 Gen running a 150 shot wet w/ bolt ons on youtube street racing . he is running pretty good . YouTube : Scott's Genesis built for nitrous VS Evo VIII / Evo X / Boosted K20 Hatch )------( and this clip on YouTube: Street Racing! 2011 Ford Mustang GT Vs Camaro, G8, Turbo Civic and Nitrous Genesis Sunday Funday
 
#50 ·
Well considering that you can make up to 420 whp with turbo fairly safe then going with 120 wet shot should be doable on a stock block with proper tuning ofcourse. That's an interesting build for sure.

Just got quoted for labor and machining for my plans, it seems to be in the right price range lol,

Shorttrack you use the 4 Maximizer progressive controller right?

I was looking at the 6 port direct injection Nitrous express kit they have it's really nice. Is there any cons to having a big bottle like 15lb vs 5 lb bottle?



In other words, stock displacement might be back on the table with custom IM and cams.
Also I bought a locals stock suspension for their top hats, I'll posting some pics of the install of the KWs. :grin:
 
#55 ·
Scale the N2O down to a 50 shot and add 10% pure toluene to 90% 93 oct ,this will give a 95.1 octane rating .Toluene 114 octane aromatic hydrocarbon (CARCINOGEN).(0.1x114)+(0.9x93)=95.1 octane .this would allow you to run a 50 shot on the 93 oct N/A tune without water/meth and no pulling of timing .Mind you that would be a plus 50 rear wheel HP and a longer run time on 1 bottle .
 
#58 ·
Hmm, I will see if i can get away with decent power at the track with reduced timing I'll do it. for the 125 shot you did, Did you have 1 step colder spark plugs?

For a 200 shot you'd have to have 2 step colder spark plugs right? How would that affect pulls without N20. Thats significant difference.
 
#57 ·
4.18:1 would have the same effect as adding 40-50 HP RWH + the 50 shot would be good to run some good low 12's with traction ( drag radial and skinny fronts )on well prep track .
 
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