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Sex Machine
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if u want to have good performance yes
 

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U wot M8
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Can u explain? I have never bought wheels before so I don't really know where to start.

Crash course:

Having tires in the rear in a staggered setup helps make oversteer more controllable and having more grip in the rear than in the front allows your front tires to break traction before your rear tires (this is without any throttle input and assuming the tires match in compound and grip). Staggered setup also allows the throttle input to be more of a decisive tool when cornering, since the rear has the higher amount of grip; you can use it mid corner to try and hit your exit line. you'll notice with the shi**y stock tires this is mute point because trying to get grip mid corner high RPM is a joke, you just break traction and the ass comes out. <where the variables start to come in (road condition, tire compound, tire condition, etc..)

Besides that; Say you enter a turn too fast, your front tires will break traction first causing the car to understeer (no throttle input) - this is safer and easier to make corrections to. A late brake will cause the weight to transfer to the front, increasing grip to the front wheels allowing you to correct (and possibly causing oversteer if you smash the throttle)

As for the wheels go, having a matched wheel to the tire width can change handling dynamics... a streched tire (to a point) can stiffen the sidewall and increase turn in feel but decrease maximum contact patch (this is why drifters us stretch because very rarely do they need straight line grip and the smaller contact patch is more responsive to throttle input).... a squared up tire will have a mix of both straight line grip and cornering fee.. an oversized tire will have decreased cornering feel but can greatly increase straight line grip.


hope that makes sense... there are a lot of variables but that is the basic functional reasoning behind RWD staggered setup I have learned from going to Auto-x skills days and such.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Ok thanks for the info. I really don't race my at around too much. I decided to go with a 8" wide wheel all around. I got a set of Motegi racing MR118. I really hope they work out for me. Thanks again for the help.
 

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Joe-Shmoe
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Ok thanks for the info. I really don't race my at around too much. I decided to go with a 8" wide wheel all around. I got a set of Motegi racing MR118. I really hope they work out for me. Thanks again for the help.
look wise, it will look a little weird because a full square set-up will have the front wheels poking out a little more then the back compared to OEM fitment.

And the traction control is programed to ensure that your wheels turn as per what the variable in the CPU are saying. OEM set-up has (example) 5% difference in total diameter. The CPU expect that, so when you bring the difference of diameter to 0%, to the CPU, it's like the tires were constantly slipping with a 5% factor. It will become a little more twitchy and aggressive with the traction control. If you pick a tire size that hit smack in the middle, then you screw up the CPU by only 2.5%...

For daily driving, it's not to bad if you are not driving aggressively.
 

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Blu, great info. I didn't realize that there was a bit of reason to actually run a stretched tire ever besides (horrible) aesthetics.

Is there a ratio that we should use when matching front tire size to rear tire size?

Thanks.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
I am sorry I made u sad slider. I didn't have to many option. I got them with my sears card. I wanted black and there was only 3 I even liked. And the mr118 were the only ones I could really afford. And they only came in a 8" width. The recomend tire sizes are the same as the stock tires. Like I said I don't auto-x or drive to hard or the street. So I hope they work. Since the fronts will be more flush then the rears could I just get spacers for the rear to still give it the staggered look? And about the traction controll system I have read other posts about it and from what I have read the staggered wheel size is not what makes the TCS come on.
 

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I am sorry I made u sad slider. I didn't have to many option. I got them with my sears card. I wanted black and there was only 3 I even liked. And the mr118 were the only ones I could really afford. And they only came in a 8" width. The recomend tire sizes are the same as the stock tires. Like I said I don't auto-x or drive to hard or the street. So I hope they work. Since the fronts will be more flush then the rears could I just get spacers for the rear to still give it the staggered look? And about the traction controll system I have read other posts about it and from what I have read the staggered wheel size is not what makes the TCS come on.
OK, after that statement I had to do a little word definition searching. Wiki says that staggered tires are when the tires are different widths. They don't mention diameters. I always assumed it was the other way. After more searching the more general consensus is whenever either the diameter or the width is different.

I believe the TCS is set to having around a 3/4" difference between the front and rears with the rears being the bigger. If you go with the same diameter front and rear you will more easily trigger the TCS as it appears that the rears are spinning faster then they should because the rears, with there larger rolling circumference, should actually be spinning slower then the fronts at a set speed.

Other then the tires spinning more easily, if they are narrower with less grip, the TCS shouldn't be effected by tire width, only by the how fast the fronts are rotating as compared to the rears. The TCS actually monitors all four tires but for tire size we are only talking about front to rear.

Anyone else want to chime in?
 

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FUNCTION OVER FORM
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Crash course:

Having tires in the rear in a staggered setup helps make oversteer more controllable and having more grip in the rear than in the front allows your front tires to break traction before your rear tires (this is without any throttle input and assuming the tires match in compound and grip). Staggered setup also allows the throttle input to be more of a decisive tool when cornering, since the rear has the higher amount of grip; you can use it mid corner to try and hit your exit line. you'll notice with the shi**y stock tires this is mute point because trying to get grip mid corner high RPM is a joke, you just break traction and the ass comes out. <where the variables start to come in (road condition, tire compound, tire condition, etc..)

Besides that; Say you enter a turn too fast, your front tires will break traction first causing the car to understeer (no throttle input) - this is safer and easier to make corrections to. A late brake will cause the weight to transfer to the front, increasing grip to the front wheels allowing you to correct (and possibly causing oversteer if you smash the throttle)

As for the wheels go, having a matched wheel to the tire width can change handling dynamics... a streched tire (to a point) can stiffen the sidewall and increase turn in feel but decrease maximum contact patch (this is why drifters us stretch because very rarely do they need straight line grip and the smaller contact patch is more responsive to throttle input).... a squared up tire will have a mix of both straight line grip and cornering fee.. an oversized tire will have decreased cornering feel but can greatly increase straight line grip.


hope that makes sense... there are a lot of variables but that is the basic functional reasoning behind RWD staggered setup I have learned from going to Auto-x skills days and such.
+1....

OK, after that statement I had to do a little word definition searching. Wiki says that staggered tires are when the tires are different widths. They don't mention diameters. I always assumed it was the other way. After more searching the more general consensus is whenever either the diameter or the width is different.

I believe the TCS is set to having around a 3/4" difference between the front and rears with the rears being the bigger. If you go with the same diameter front and rear you will more easily trigger the TCS as it appears that the rears are spinning faster then they should because the rears, with there larger rolling circumference, should actually be spinning slower then the fronts at a set speed.

Other then the tires spinning more easily, if they are narrower with less grip, the TCS shouldn't be effected by tire width, only by the how fast the fronts are rotating as compared to the rears. The TCS actually monitors all four tires but for tire size we are only talking about front to rear.

Anyone else want to chime in?
+1....sounds pretty accurate
 

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U wot M8
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OK, after that statement I had to do a little word definition searching. Wiki says that staggered tires are when the tires are different widths. They don't mention diameters. I always assumed it was the other way. After more searching the more general consensus is whenever either the diameter or the width is different.

I believe the TCS is set to having around a 3/4" difference between the front and rears with the rears being the bigger. If you go with the same diameter front and rear you will more easily trigger the TCS as it appears that the rears are spinning faster then they should because the rears, with there larger rolling circumference, should actually be spinning slower then the fronts at a set speed.

Other then the tires spinning more easily, if they are narrower with less grip, the TCS shouldn't be effected by tire width, only by the how fast the fronts are rotating as compared to the rears. The TCS actually monitors all four tires but for tire size we are only talking about front to rear.

Anyone else want to chime in?

yup your right... but when you have a wider tire like stock in the rear...

225/40 front 245/40 rear.. the rear ends up being taller because the sidewall height will be 40% of 225 and 40% of 245 so the rolling diameter (assuming 19" stocks) of the rear ends up being 16mm larger than the front

cliffs notes: tire width directly affects rolling diameter
 

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FUNCTION OVER FORM
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yup your right... but when you have a wider tire like stock in the rear...

225/40 front 245/40 rear.. the rear ends up being taller because the sidewall height will be 40% of 225 and 40% of 245 so the rolling diameter (assuming 19" stocks) of the rear ends up being 16mm larger than the front

cliffs notes: tire width directly affects rolling diameter
+1

Which is why you drop profile (sidewall height) when you go with wider tires in order to achieve overall wheel/tire diameter close to stock (i.e go from 245/40R19 to 285/35R19. ;)
 

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Love me some me!!!
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What if I want to run a 19" wheel in the front and a 20" wheel in the back? Would that still be considered staggered? Is it possible? Anyone else running it?
 

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FUNCTION OVER FORM
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What if I want to run a 19" wheel in the front and a 20" wheel in the back? Would that still be considered staggered? Is it possible? Anyone else running it?
It would still be considered staggered, but I wouldn't do it. It is possible & some cars like the Plymouth Prowler came that way, but you may have to do some investigating to confirm it won't interfere with your traction control.
 

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Premium Member
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951 Posts
What if I want to run a 19" wheel in the front and a 20" wheel in the back? Would that still be considered staggered? Is it possible? Anyone else running it?
The TCS doesn't care what the Wheel size is. It only recognizes the overall diameter of the tires. Most will hate on this idea, but I actually plan to do it, myself. Every time I see a Coupe with 19's front and rear, the rear look smaller than the front to me. Probably because of the very rakish wedge shape of our car. I could only find one picture of a Coupe running 19f and 20r:



From this angle, the rear looks quite large, but I saw another picture of the same car from a straight side shot a long time ago, and it looked perfect. I personally plan to use the following specs:
19x8.5 +20-25 245/35/19 Front
20x10 +25-30 285/30/20 Rear

That keeps close to the same diameter ratio that the TCS is looking for.
 

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U wot M8
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1,908 Posts
staggered Diameters can look good on the Genesis because of that high rear belt line.

like vettes, just gotta calculate the tire sizes correct and it shouldn't be a prob


another car with a high rear belt line and staggered diameter wheels.

 
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