No LSD On My 3.8 Track??

3574 Views 24 Replies 14 Participants Last post by GeorgeK, Feb 12, 2011

jaybone909

Discussion Starter · Feb 1, 2011

Today I attempted to get to work using my GC even though my street is still covered in snow and ice! (God damn town

) Anyways, I backed out of my driveway, went over a little speed bump of snow and ice, and my car got stuck!

I wouldn't go anywhere in 1st or 2nd. Traction control on or off. Idling or giving it a decent amount of gas. I heard my tires spinning on and off but here's the strange part, when I went out to check things out, only my back left tire left a black skid mark on the snow\ice. It's as if the right wasn't spinning!

I'll have to get someone to check it out when I give it gas but this isn't the first time it seemed like 1 tire was spinning. I thought the whole point of having LSD was to distribute power equally to both tires?!

Could it be possible that it's broke or maybe the damn dealer stole it off to screw me? Seriously though, is it possible that it could've been disabled or not installed? Thanks

1 - 20 of 25 Posts

carbonair

· #2 · Feb 1, 2011

subscribed

whatnot

· #3 · Feb 1, 2011 (Edited)

There is a TBR (torque bias rataio) probably closer to 4:1 and even 100:1 it might not move. As 0 times 100 is 0. If your slipping tires has no tq, your other tire won't either. One technique is to put the parking brake on a bit so the tire has to work to move giving it tq and supplying that torque to the other tire..... though you might have both tires slipping still. I have been in snow with 4 tires slipping on 4x4. Deflating your tires a bit can help, though winter tires would be your best bet. Sitting there flooring it isn't the best aciton either, you just melt the snow and turn that water into ice making it more slippery.

You can't 'disable' a torsen LSD, it is mechanical, and I highly highly doubt it was mistakenly uninstalled.

carbonair

· #4 · Feb 1, 2011

i thought applying the E brake trick didnt apply for LSD ??? ( trying to learn a bit here too)

whatnot

· #5 · Feb 1, 2011

What do you mean "not apply for LSD", what else would it apply for? A torson type LSD uses a TBR and that 'multipies' tq to the other tire. You can wiki it if you don't believe me. Putting the brakes slightly increases tq to the tire.

It is possible that is doesn't work for a viscous LSD or maybe a clutch pack LSD (since you need a lot of tq to lock that up) though I haven't studied as much on the other types.

SouthernGenesis

· #6 · Feb 1, 2011

Our track edtion comes with a LSD (limited slip diff). Basically it will allow a limited amount of slippage between the two wheels. Being that its not a full lock up rear in like what your thinking of, if one tire looses complete trackson the other tire will not spin. Poor man tip if you get in this situation again pull up your e-break to help the limited slip do its job. Another tip don't spin in snow and track models came with all perfomance summer tire not all seasons like our brothers. So they suck in snow

carbonair

· #7 · Feb 1, 2011

sorry maybe should have elaborated! I was aware of the E brake thing....... as my car continues to get stuck in these canadian winters! however when talking randomly to one of the Hyundai mechanics, he was explaining that the E brake thing doesnt work on LSD differentials and only works for an open differential! So completely understand the mechanics of a differential, I just had one of their mechanics saying it doesn't apply to a Genesis' LSD

LiMike

· #8 · Feb 1, 2011

yessss snow = little lock i have the same snow problem dw about it your fine

SouthernGenesis

· #9 · Feb 1, 2011

I typed all that on my phone. I would have been first

whatnot

· #10 · Feb 1, 2011 (Edited)

I hate this site on my phone, it takes like 5 mins for a page to load.

This is a good diffeneital video

qwaszx

· #11 · Feb 1, 2011

good video

carbonair

· #12 · Feb 1, 2011

second'er

c boogy

· #13 · Feb 1, 2011

I had the same thing happen to me and i was worried that my LSD already broke on me, thanks for al the info guys

whatnot

· #14 · Feb 1, 2011

I am no expert but it it siezes, your diff will lock up, if parts of it breaks, the chunks will tear the diff apart, and you will feel it, either way, I think you would notice if it broke. Any one know if it is possible to wear the helical gears out and not notice.

brad

· #15 · Feb 1, 2011

I know on some rear diffs than they can engage (as if one tire was starting to slip) when the fluid needs to be changed. From my experience they sound just like some of the bunk LSDs that are out there on the Genesis Coupes.

I have no idea for wearing though, I've never worn out or driven a car with a worn out LSD or even differential.

SouthernGenesis

· #16 · Feb 1, 2011

whatnot said:
I am no expert but it it siezes, your diff will lock up, if parts of it breaks, the chunks will tear the diff apart, and you will feel it, either way, I think you would notice if it broke. Any one know if it is possible to wear the helical gears out and not notice.

I had a jeep cherokee DD that had 300,000+ miles on it when the open diff spider gears locked up and snapped the center pin. its funny when your driving along and your tires and axle shafts pass you

jaybone909

Discussion Starter · #17 · Feb 1, 2011

Thanks to everybody for the help! I never knew about the EB trick. I refused to buy winter tires. I think I would much rather buy a winter beater. I def need new tires as the treads are pretty worn but I'll save my money for performance tires in the spring.

Mcmonopoly

· #18 · Feb 1, 2011 (Edited)

jaybone909 said:
Today I attempted to get to work using my GC even though my street is still covered in snow and ice! (God damn town) Anyways, I backed out of my driveway, went over a little speed bump of snow and ice, and my car got stuck!

I wouldn't go anywhere in 1st or 2nd. Traction control on or off. Idling or giving it a decent amount of gas. I heard my tires spinning on and off but here's the strange part, when I went out to check things out, only my back left tire left a black skid mark on the snowice. It's as if the right wasn't spinning!

I'll have to get someone to check it out when I give it gas but this isn't the first time it seemed like 1 tire was spinning. I thought the whole point of having LSD was to distribute power equally to both tires?!

Could it be possible that it's broke or maybe the damn dealer stole it off to screw me? Seriously though, is it possible that it could've been disabled or not installed? Thanks

carbonair said:
i thought applying the E brake trick didnt apply for LSD ??? ( trying to learn a bit here too)

carbonair said:
sorry maybe should have elaborated! I was aware of the E brake thing....... as my car continues to get stuck in these canadian winters! however when talking randomly to one of the Hyundai mechanics, he was explaining that the E brake thing doesnt work on LSD differentials and only works for an open differential! So completely understand the mechanics of a differential, I just had one of their mechanics saying it doesn't apply to a Genesis' LSD

brad said:
I know on some rear diffs than they can engage (as if one tire was starting to slip) when the fluid needs to be changed. From my experience they sound just like some of the bunk LSDs that are out there on the Genesis Coupes.

I have no idea for wearing though, I've never worn out or driven a car with a worn out LSD or even differential.

^^None of this is right.

Pretty sure you can't wear out a MECHANICAL helical gear type LSD (Torsen), unless you run it without any oil.

whatnot said:
What do you mean "not apply for LSD", what else would it apply for? A torson type LSD uses a TBR and that 'multipies' tq to the other tire. You can wiki it if you don't believe me. Putting the brakes slightly increases tq to the tire.

It is possible that is doesn't work for a viscous LSD or maybe a clutch pack LSD (since you need a lot of tq to lock that up) though I haven't studied as much on the other types.

whatnot said:
I am no expert but it it siezes, your diff will lock up, if parts of it breaks, the chunks will tear the diff apart, and you will feel it, either way, I think you would notice if it broke. Any one know if it is possible to wear the helical gears out and not notice.

whatnot said:
There is a TBR (torque bias rataio) probably closer to 4:1 and even 100:1 it might not move. As 0 times 100 is 0. If your slipping tires has no tq, your other tire won't either. One technique is to put the parking brake on a bit so the tire has to work to move giving it tq and supplying that torque to the other tire..... though you might have both tires slipping still. I have been in snow with 4 tires slipping on 4x4. Deflating your tires a bit can help, though winter tires would be your best bet. Sitting there flooring it isn't the best aciton either, you just melt the snow and turn that water into ice making it more slippery.

You can't 'disable' a torsen LSD, it is mechanical, and I highly highly doubt it was mistakenly uninstalled.

SouthernGenesis said:
Our track edtion comes with a LSD (limited slip diff). Basically it will allow a limited amount of slippage between the two wheels. Being that its not a full lock up rear in like what your thinking of, if one tire looses complete trackson the other tire will not spin. Poor man tip if you get in this situation again pull up your e-break to help the limited slip do its job. Another tip don't spin in snow and track models came with all performance summer tire not all seasons like our brothers. So they suck in snow

^^All of this is Right.

jaybone909 said:
Thanks to everybody for the help! I never knew about the EB trick. I refused to buy winter tires. I think I would much rather buy a winter beater. I def need new tires as the treads are pretty worn but I'll save my money for performance tires in the spring.

E-brake or plain brakes applied to a slipping Torsen LSD will lock the LSD so it can try and send some torque to the "open" wheel.

If some of you ever had AWD trucks with LSDs but no locking diffs, the user manual usually states to use the brakes to lock the diffs. My buddy's Xterra has 2 LSDs, but not locking diffs (4X4), and the manual says to apply brake to "generate" A TQ bias so the Diff can send power to the slipping wheels.

So for all the people saying the LSD in the GC is Uber leet for winter driving, you can suck it...LOL

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whatnot

· #19 · Feb 1, 2011 (Edited)

The treads have little to do with traction in the snow, they are more for water and hydroplaning preveention. What makes a snow tire a snow tires is the little 'knobs' that grip it. The treads have some use, but it isn't the main thing in snow. If you had no treads left but some knobs over a car with no knobs and full tread, the former would do much better in the snow. That and winter tires usually aren't 275, they are closer to 225, the more surface area you have the more you 'float' on the snow, vs. 'sink' into it and let the tires grab some asphalt underneath. Even a 4x4 with 295'sX19 isn't on summer tires probably isn't going anywhere in the snow, though it helps to weighta ton.

neoshi

· #20 · Feb 1, 2011 (Edited)

Think of it this way...

If you have an AWD system and are running summers, chances are you will probably not do well in snow and ice.

If you don't even have an AWD system but are running snow tires (with studs for ice), chances are you will probably do better than the aforementioned setup.

Tires make a HUGE difference.

This is actually one of the major problems with Subaru and Audi owners thinking they can conquer everything with the OEM tires. It'll accomplish quite a bit, but you're just being complacent in most situations (I'm a Subie driver btw).

1 - 20 of 25 Posts

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