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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
So I was one of the idiots who bought the NSPP from RRM way back when and I recently received word back from the Better Business Bureau (BBB) after I filed a complaint (as obviously many others did...32 out of 35 are demanding a refund as stated by the BBB).

The following is RRM's response to my complaint filed back in March.

Company's Response

Company's Initial Response - Posted 01/21/2011
"This product was dyno tested by our company and many other independent customers, numerous results exceeded our initial hp claims and some did not meet the claims. He was also supplied with updated software for further tuning of the device. When offered a full refund if he returned the item he said he liked the performance of the part and refused to return it.
Initial Response Summary
When offered a full refund if he returned the item he said he liked the performance of the part and refused to return it."

The the last part of the statement is completely false as no one was given the option of a full refund. I tried disputing the charge via my credit card company which involved me sending the unit back to them with delivery confirmation. Capital One blows so I ended up going nowhere with a dispute.:mad2: In the end, I closed my account with Capital One.

I guess my ultimate question is if anyone else has received information such as this from the BBB in regards to a claim. It would be nice if there could be some sort of closure to this whole fiasco as I never got the satisfaction of destroying my NSPP like other members did. My NSPP ended up back in the hands of RRM and probably was re-sold to another poor soul.


*****EDIT*****

The following is an update to my claim with BBB. RRM is a piece of work. This guy really should take an English class.




We have closed our file and we appreciate your using the Better Business Bureau. This complaint will remain in our file on this company and will be a part of the report we issue to the public.

If we can assist you in the future, please contact us.

Thank you.



The product was proven by independent users to not work as advertised. Despite Road Race Motorsports' policy stating there are no returns on electrical items, of 35 users of the product, 32 demand a refund.

Complaint Summary: Product was not as advertised.
Resolution Sought: Refund.

Additional Information
Date Problem First Occurred: 3/18/2010
Product or Service: Electrical unit plugging into the MAF sensor of a vehicle
Model Name or Number: Next Stage Power Pro Genesis V6

Company's Response
Company's Initial Response - Posted 01/21/2011
This product was dyno tested by our company and many other independent customers, numerous results exceeded our initial hp claims and some did not meet the claims. He was also supplied with updated software for further tuning of the device. When offered a full refund if he returned the item he said he liked the performance of the part and refused to return it.
Initial Response Summary
When offered a full refund if he returned the item he said he liked the performance of the part and refused to return it.


Consumer's Rebuttal
Consumer's Rebuttal - Posted 01/23/2011
"When offered a full refund if he returned the item he said he liked the performance of the part and refused to return it." This is a complete lie as I never claimed to like the performance of the part. Why would I return the item, demand a refund and report Road Race Motorsports to the BBB if I was satisfied with said product? 32 out of 35 users demand a refund for this product. Does that not say enough? The product does NOT WORK! Plain and simple.



Company's Final Response
Company's Final Response - Posted 01/26/2011
More than 100 of thee unit were sold and they were independently tested and even tested in an open test where customers where invited to observe. THis was done in response to certain people who casted doubt on the product due to the improper technique that they used in testing the item. These product needed to going trough a learning process. This was discovered shortly after release of the product, but by then, public opinion was crafted and could not be changed. It was further fueled by a competitor that bribed customers with free product if they would demand a refund from us and post on forums that the product did not work. So slander and liable Road Race and you get a $400 piece of software for free. Pretty compelling stuff. This was conveyed to us by 3 or 4 different customers that could in good conscience do something as unethical as this to an honest vendor. This is how it happened during that time. The term lynch mob describes this situation as led by a select few people. I can attach emails of people who liked it and were honest about it. I wish I could attach emails here.
 

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It's sad that a couple guys including you had to get burned in other for other members to see the crooked ways of that company. I hope you get your full refund.
 

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I still have mine sitting in a box somewhere. I chalked it up as a lesson learned. I know that I was offered a refund but was teased that they were going to offer a free tuning software solution so I kept it in hopes of being able to use it. Of course we all found out that the tuning software was a joke just like the NSPP was. It still irritates me whenever I see RRM sponsored cars in magazines.
 

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RRM can suck it...told all my EVO buddies never to get crap from them
 

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Discussion Starter #5
I still have mine sitting in a box somewhere. I chalked it up as a lesson learned. I know that I was offered a refund but was teased that they were going to offer a free tuning software solution so I kept it in hopes of being able to use it. Of course we all found out that the tuning software was a joke just like the NSPP was. It still irritates me whenever I see RRM sponsored cars in magazines.
You were offered a refund? It's stated in their policy "NO RETURNS ON ELECTRONIC ITEMS". I asked for a refund but was denied and have e-mails to prove it.

Do you have any literature of them offering a refund?
 

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^ that was way back when they where actually working with customers.They gave me a refund during the debacle only because i told them i'll independent dyno for them. End of the day i still lost money like many others.

Like chem said, lesson learned.
 

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On phrase that would get them out of any legal binding, unfortunately.

"off-road use only"
 

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^ that was way back when they where actually working with customers.They gave me a refund during the debacle only because i told them i'll independent dyno for them. End of the day i still lost money like many others.

Like chem said, lesson learned.
Exactly! Nice to see you around Ed.
 

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some of the sonata guys actually are getting use out of them now. and it's working. i sold mine when i found out it would be usefule to someone. but i was like the third person to sell. there are probably still some sonata guys out there looking.
 

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some of the sonata guys actually are getting use out of them now. and it's working. i sold mine when i found out it would be usefule to someone. but i was like the third person to sell. there are probably still some sonata guys out there looking.
Thats how I got rid of mine as well :D
 

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I'm willing to sell mine if some Sonata owner wants it. :D
 

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Really this probably would have worked if some evil hyundai software engineer didn't make our ecu's 2048 bit, hasp key required, auto learning and programing T1000 AI with a tripple Chuck Norris encoding...

But hey... then some other failing company could reverse engineer it too... maybe FIAT is trying to steel hyundai's hard work <grin> you never know.

<shrug> best thing to do IMO is try to get a reimbursement for a non working product through you CC company - they will probably ask for proof and the part. And if your CC card sucks... well then... see line 3 of my signature and chalk it up to a learnin' lesson ;(

Though - ONE good thing came out of the NSPP stuff... I was talkin' to an EVO buddy of mine and she knew of the NSPP issues from here and had nothing to say good about the company, so... at least the word of mouth negative advertising IS working.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Really this probably would have worked if some evil hyundai software engineer didn't make our ecu's 2048 bit, hasp key required, auto learning and programing T1000 AI with a tripple Chuck Norris encoding...

But hey... then some other failing company could reverse engineer it too... maybe FIAT is trying to steel hyundai's hard work <grin> you never know.

<shrug> best thing to do IMO is try to get a reimbursement for a non working product through you CC company - they will probably ask for proof and the part. And if your CC card sucks... well then... see line 3 of my signature and chalk it up to a learnin' lesson ;(

Though - ONE good thing came out of the NSPP stuff... I was talkin' to an EVO buddy of mine and she knew of the NSPP issues from here and had nothing to say good about the company, so... at least the word of mouth negative advertising IS working.
Yeh....CC company was zero help as they needed "proof" the part did not work. However, they asked me to ship the part back to RRM before I could even file a claim. Kind of hard to test the product after I have shipped it back.

Lesson learned.....thats for sure. Never, EVER do business with Road Race Motorsports again. Chuck Norris would not approve.
 

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Welcome to politics. The process of trying to get a refund through BBB or your CC company is not exactly easy. Most people who have gone through this process in the past learn to just cut their losses. I guess a lot depends on the amount of money though.


Back in my college years, I bought a school book brand new, wrapped from the bookstore (located IN the campus) for $200. Walked to my class, learned that I purchased the wrong book. Literally 1 hour later I walked back to the bookstore to exchange the book (still in its original wrapping), and was told no by the same dude who sold me the book. ( i even had the receipt still).

How ridiculous is that? After being shrugged off by managers and even the campus administration, they finally gave me a refund after I promised to post flyer's all over campus telling students to go to amazon to get their books at 60% cheaper.
 

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Welcome to politics. The process of trying to get a refund through BBB or your CC company is not exactly easy. Most people who have gone through this process in the past learn to just cut their losses. I guess a lot depends on the amount of money though.


Back in my college years, I bought a school book brand new, wrapped from the bookstore (located IN the campus) for $200. Walked to my class, learned that I purchased the wrong book. Literally 1 hour later I walked back to the bookstore to exchange the book (still in its original wrapping), and was told no by the same dude who sold me the book. ( i even had the receipt still).

How ridiculous is that? After being shrugged off by managers and even the campus administration, they finally gave me a refund after I promised to post flyer's all over campus telling students to go to amazon to get their books at 60% cheaper.
I always bought my books on half.com. I would go get the ISBN from the school bookstore and just look for them on half. Sorry to go off topic.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
I always bought my books on half.com. I would go get the ISBN from the school bookstore and just look for them on half. Sorry to go off topic.
Right there with ya man....University Bookstores are a complete scam in my mind. When you are buying your own books, you learn quick how to save a buck.

International versions of books are yet another way of grabbing a discount. The book for a finance class I am taking right now was $220 at the bookstore....$100 online (Non-international) and $30 online for the international version.
 

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got a similar email from BBB

I can't beleive that RRM would take sooo long to even get a reply to the BBB after the initial complaint.


Company's Response
Company's Initial Response - Posted 01/21/2011
This product was dyno tested by our company and many other independent customers, numerous results exceeded our initial hp claims and some did not meet the claims. We have numerous emails showing that this customer was completely happy with the part, he was only unhappy when he read and internet post stating that another customer made less power than was claimed. He then switched his story and was unhappy with the part for no reason. He was also supplied with updated software for further tuning of the device. He never return the part and only wanted to get “some stickers” though. R Tallini Road/ Race
Initial Response Summary
He never return the part and only wanted to get “some stickers” though.




my Rebuttal

RRM may have done a dyno on the product, and it may have tested okay. After installing the product the car did begin to feel more responsive and better but after another 5-6 weeks the car seemed to be 'normal'. yes i did ask for stickers initially, since i was happy. but after noticing that the car felt less responsive after weeks, i looked at the online forums to see if others were having the same problems. I was not the only one complaining. After much pressure, RRM investigated and came to the conclusion that the GAINS from THEIR PRODUCT were TEMPORARY, since the stock Delphi ECU was doing something to make the BOXES USELESS. This CONCLUSION WAS REACH BY RRM. Obviously they did not do long term tests on their product and sold "Paper weights" to those who bought the NSPP from RRM. Asked for a refund, and they stalled me. and were rude. ignored calls and would not return emails and messages sent from their webpage. Eventually Capital One Credit card charged me the full amount that they had initially cedited me....tried to reyurn NSPP, but was unable to get an RMA number.

Poor Customer service, poor company, and poor product (NSPP). I will never buy from them




So I was one of the idiots who bought the NSPP from RRM way back when and I recently received word back from the Better Business Bureau (BBB) after I filed a complaint (as obviously many others did...32 out of 35 are demanding a refund as stated by the BBB).

The following is RRM's response to my complaint filed back in March.

Company's Response

Company's Initial Response - Posted 01/21/2011
"This product was dyno tested by our company and many other independent customers, numerous results exceeded our initial hp claims and some did not meet the claims. He was also supplied with updated software for further tuning of the device. When offered a full refund if he returned the item he said he liked the performance of the part and refused to return it.
Initial Response Summary
When offered a full refund if he returned the item he said he liked the performance of the part and refused to return it."

The the last part of the statement is completely false as no one was given the option of a full refund. I tried disputing the charge via my credit card company which involved me sending the unit back to them with delivery confirmation. Capital One blows so I ended up going nowhere with a dispute.:mad2: In the end, I closed my account with Capital One.

I guess my ultimate question is if anyone else has received information such as this from the BBB in regards to a claim. It would be nice if there could be some sort of closure to this whole fiasco as I never got the satisfaction of destroying my NSPP like other members did. My NSPP ended up back in the hands of RRM and probably was re-sold to another poor soul.
 
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