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MR TURBO 2 U
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Discussion Starter #1
has anyone considered titanium exhausts, air intakes and cooler plumbing?

one of my suppliers has been nagging me to test it for years and has just replied that he makes ss systems for the gen coupe but is bound to not supply the same product but at his suggestion i can get the same fit in titanium or supply my own ss designs!

well china is shut down for 2 weeks now they will be back on your 14th but would be good to see if there is any interest? i know there is in china with my clients there!

yes these will be made in china for china but are of the best quality and will rival any system!
 

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Someone already makes Ti exhaust.

As for IC no. People have on other applications. just not on the gen.

example





 

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MR TURBO 2 U
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Discussion Starter #3
nice use of 240-60z and vh45 nissan yum!
 

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I guess it all comes down to the weight and performance difference versus cost.

Since the GC is heavy in the front already I'd be most concerned w/ reducing weight up front personally. Especially to offset the impending weight of your turbo kit that I hope to install soon!
 

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MR TURBO 2 U
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Discussion Starter #5
I guess it all comes down to the weight and performance difference versus cost.

Since the GC is heavy in the front already I'd be most concerned w/ reducing weight up front personally. Especially to offset the impending weight of your turbo kit that I hope to install soon!
personally i'm no fan i just posted it to guage what peeps think coz there on the shelf and they'll be cheap just need to convince the chinese of it now!
 

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I'd ditch my Injen for a Ti exhaust as long as it sounds nice. How cheap are we talking here? Ti exhausts are usually a very pricey item.
 

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Titanium exhausts are nice if they are done right, but it is very hard to do. It takes a lot of skill and the right setup to do quality titanium welding. The metal oxidizes very easily in the atmosphere when it is hot. For example, the pics in AKGC's post are good examples of BAD titanium welds. A proper Ti weld should have no blue or white coloring.

Phase,
If you can get quality exhausts, I may be interested, but they would have to be of high quality. Otherwise there's little advantage over stainless.
 

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MR TURBO 2 U
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862 Posts
Discussion Starter #8
I'd ditch my Injen for a Ti exhaust as long as it sounds nice. How cheap are we talking here? Ti exhausts are usually a very pricey item.
the second hardest thing in life to do is sell a chinaman his own countries products! they are cheap they are most probably cheaper than most s/s systems and they put most s/s systems to shame in looks!

i have not tested them nor did i design these they were just offered to me to try and buy

ill keep you updated on my tests in china
 

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MR TURBO 2 U
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Discussion Starter #9
Titanium exhausts are nice if they are done right, but it is very hard to do. It takes a lot of skill and the right setup to do quality titanium welding. The metal oxidizes very easily in the atmosphere when it is hot. For example, the pics in AKGC's post are good examples of BAD titanium welds. A proper Ti weld should have no blue or white coloring.

Phase,
If you can get quality exhausts, I may be interested, but they would have to be of high quality. Otherwise there's little advantage over stainless.
yes there is no performance advantage over ss its just weight and looks!
 

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Yea, the only real advantage is weight savings and a boost in ego since you can say that you have titanium parts on your car.

However, if you have titanium parts with badly oxidized welds, this can causelong-term issues such as brittle joints and increase chances of breakage. Especcially on exhausts since they see lots of heat cycles.

A quality Ti weld should look like this across the entire heat affected zone, this means on the "other side" of the weld as well.
 

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MR TURBO 2 U
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Discussion Starter #11
Yea, the only real advantage is weight savings and a boost in ego since you can say that you have titanium parts on your car.

However, if you have titanium parts with badly oxidized welds, this can causelong-term issues such as brittle joints and increase chances of breakage. Especcially on exhausts since they see lots of heat cycles.

A quality Ti weld should look like this across the entire heat affected zone, this means on the "other side" of the weld as well.
yes welds are important but also on ss systems

btw can i please use n abuse ur avi? shes hot!:hsugh::hsugh::hsugh:
 

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not necessarily bad welds as far as technique, more like not enough gas and not letting it cool down enough between passes. :p
 

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It is not red. Not red..
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I could be interested..
 

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yes there is no performance advantage over ss its just weight and looks!
When I lived in SoCal I use to buy new bikes every year when they were first released and lend them to the local exhaust builder so they could build product.

They would always test multiple configurations in steel before doing the final production product in Ti and they ALWAYS made more hp w/ the Ti. I asked the guy designing them, who is now a MotoGP Mechanic, what was going on because we overlayed the graphs of the final steel version over the production version and the production version made an additional .75-1hp all across the entire powerband. He said "I don't know but that has happened every time. I think the Ti doesn't absorb heat as quickly and the system maintains better velocity. Either way the Ti version always makes more hp in back to back tests w/ identical specifications."
 

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MR TURBO 2 U
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Discussion Starter #15
When I lived in SoCal I use to buy new bikes every year when they were first released and lend them to the local exhaust builder so they could build product.

They would always test multiple configurations in steel before doing the final production product in Ti and they ALWAYS made more hp w/ the Ti. I asked the guy designing them, who is now a MotoGP Mechanic, what was going on because we overlayed the graphs of the final steel version over the production version and the production version made an additional .75-1hp all across the entire powerband. He said "I don't know but that has happened every time. I think the Ti doesn't absorb heat as quickly and the system maintains better velocity. Either way the Ti version always makes more hp in back to back tests w/ identical specifications."
ive heard similar but never seen the difference on the dyno?
 

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Phase,
yes, quality welds are important on stainless exhausts also, but its MUCH easier to screw up a weld on Ti than it is on steel. And yea, she is really hot. I don't know if you noticed, but there's a car in that image also ;-). That's actually Pmastron's car. We had a photo shoot at the shop about a year or so ago with some models, and he was nice enough to let us use his car. If you want to see more, you can go here:
http://www.velocityfactor.net/GenesisPhotoShoot/




AKGC,
I suppose, but isn't running enough gas and letting it cool down enough between passes all a part of good technique :p? And it's not just a matter of letting it cool down enough. The entire HAZ needs to be shielded in argon while it's cooling off, including the back of the weld also. So they would need to run argon inside the exhaust pipe, and over the face of the weld. Either that or perform the entire welding process inside of a chamber that has been purged with argon.




Suns_PSD,
you think maybe it could have something to do with the resonance of the material possibly affecting the wave action of the exhaust?




--Art.
 

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MR TURBO 2 U
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862 Posts
Discussion Starter #17
Phase,
yes, quality welds are important on stainless exhausts also, but its MUCH easier to screw up a weld on Ti than it is on steel. And yea, she is really hot. I don't know if you noticed, but there's a car in that image also ;-). That's actually Pmastron's car. We had a photo shoot at the shop about a year or so ago with some models, and he was nice enough to let us use his car. If you want to see more, you can go here:
http://www.velocityfactor.net/GenesisPhotoShoot/

ok i'd pay to abuse her lol! in a nice way of course! thanks for the link!

AKGC,
I suppose, but isn't running enough gas and letting it cool down enough between passes all a part of good technique :p? And it's not just a matter of letting it cool down enough. The entire HAZ needs to be shielded in argon while it's cooling off, including the back of the weld also. So they would need to run argon inside the exhaust pipe, and over the face of the weld. Either that or perform the entire welding process inside of a chamber that has been purged with argon.

they do a good job of it the chinese better than i could ever do!

Suns_PSD,
you think maybe it could have something to do with the resonance of the material possibly affecting the wave action of the exhaust?




--Art.
its possible it flows better but i ain't ever seen it? anyone mandrel bending it right yet?
these chop and weld bends will loose flow! minutely but will!
 

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In Charge of Snacks
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I thought the main reason Ti wasn't mandrel bent was it's propensity to crack? Can it be done properly outside a forge/furnace? Also, a strange idea to consider, but don't many Ti alloys return to their original cast/forged shape when heat cycled? I'm not sure any cold forming of Ti is advisable.

BTW, If they offer comparable performance I'll friggin' buy your products in Ti and pay the hefty pan Pacific shipping to boot SPECIFICALLY for the weight savings. I'm obsessed with trying to lighten this whale I've bought. Hell, I'll buy you a Victoria Bitters and a roo burger to go with it.
 

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In Charge of Snacks
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Titanium exhausts are nice if they are done right, but it is very hard to do. It takes a lot of skill and the right setup to do quality titanium welding. The metal oxidizes very easily in the atmosphere when it is hot. For example, the pics in AKGC's post are good examples of BAD titanium welds. A proper Ti weld should have no blue or white coloring.

Phase,
If you can get quality exhausts, I may be interested, but they would have to be of high quality. Otherwise there's little advantage over stainless.
I thought the fabricators intentionally reduced the argon flow in Ti tig welding for looks. I know in my biz when we see a structural Ti part it's always near colorless.
 

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In Charge of Snacks
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Someone already makes Ti exhaust.

As for IC no. People have on other applications. just not on the gen.
A titanium IC would be a detriment to performance anyway. Ti simply cannot conduct heat efficiently. Aluminum is the best combo of tensile strength, rigidity, density, and thermal conductivity available. That is until some lunatic with a methane injected high temp autoclave makes a carbon-carbon composite material with a uniform distribution of copper or, better yet, silver filaments. A materials geek can dream, can't he?
 
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